HIGH_INTREST

How bad does a rebuilt tite kill the value on a 1966 Corvette convertible? I know it makes a huge difference on late model Vettes but what about later years.

scotty67

Whenever I sold a car that I rebuilt with a salvage title, you can figure about a 20% deduction from bluebook. However, there are always exceptions to the rule, like document everything you have done to the car and was it wrecked or just theft stripped, big difference to a buyer if it was just stripped. I've sold 930s for just a couple grand under bluebook that were just partially stripped.

Kensmith

In Calif it's about a 25% hit if the car was repaired properly. Personally, I think if it was a theft without collision damage, DMV should not salvage the title. But to protect buyers, it's a good procedure to mark the title salvaged.

vettebuyer6369

I think a 25% hit is very low. I'd advise buyers to expect much more or walk away. That's what will happen when they go to sell.

rgs

As we have recently learned here on the forum, certain states do not need a transferring title on pre 1980 cars in order to issue a new title, just a bill of sale. Find a GOOD friend in one of these states with another classic car, and trade cars for a month (gets around at least the federal tax laws, trading of like kind collectibles). Give each other bills of sales dated a month apart. Poof, the salvage title goes away and a clean title appears. As much as I don't think this is ethical, apparently it is legal.
When I bought my 67 BB, it had a California off road title. When I presented it here in Iowa, they gave me a current tilte, registration, and plates, no questions.

HIGH_INTREST

The point is I have a chance to purchase a 66 BB convertible with a rebuilt title and no documentation and 350 instead of 427. The car has been altered in the front (headlights molded closed) and front bumper removed. The fenders are slightly flared and six tail lights. The car is pretty clean, fresh paint and has hard top. Any how I can purchase the car for $17,500,let me know what you think.

hope2

junk is junk. making money is making money. greed is greed. fraud is fraud.

sleep at night?

Midyearnut

Do just the engine/body mods qualify the '66 for a "Rebuilt Title" or are there other issues involved? It seems to me if it's just the mods alot of cars would fit that category.
Bob L.

Midyearnut

Do just the engine/body mods qualify the '66 for a "Rebuilt Title" or are there other issues involved? It seems to me if it's just the mods alot of cars would fit that category. Am I missing something?
Bob L.

67L36Driver

That's a very good price. There are several 'project cars' (Junk!) on Ebay lately going for much more than that.

Just remember it will always be a NOM '66 regardless of BB or SB.

Too many have done full restorations and wound up with garage queens that they are afraid to drive.

w1ctc

When the C2's were going for $2 to $3k. The repair of the glass body could easily total the car for insurance purposes. With some of the high dollar cars, I don't think they could be totaled as long as the serial number tag is left intact.

yooperod

why would an old car get a branded title.?
you have to decide how you want to finish the car, and does it matter to you in the long run,
rgs's idea might work,


I always thought branding the titles is BS. In michigan late model cars can get branded depending damage, some rough numbers here.

If an insurance company has a 04 corvette with a ACV of $50k with a damage estimate of $34K
they will fix it and it will have a clear title.

if the car was an 01 with a ACV of $28k with a damage estimate of $21k
the car would total and be branded salvage(rebuild) or possibly scrap.
now which car had less damage?
If estimates indicate a safer vehicle (not really), I'd rather own the 01

rgs

I suppose since my post was copied and used in another thread, I should post here my response there also.

As to the post concerning titles, on this one, I have no problem with clearing a salvage title. The purpose of the salvage title is to keep people from stealing parts to repair a damaged car. At least in my state, a salvage title indicates that the car was salvage but retains the identity of the chassis. Someone In Iowa with an Iowa salvage title can legally clear it to a normal title by presenting it to a DOT inspector for them to verify the numbers (oh no, not the numbers again!) of the block, transmission, and chassis along with receipts for major components identified on the salvage title as damaged. The salvage title then is converted to a regular title and all record of the salvage status is gone.

Plastic Pig

You are completely wrong about the purpose of a salvage title.

The purpose of a salvage title is to keep people from rebuilding totalled vehicles and then not representing them as such when selling to unassuming buyers. It is a consumer protection law. Could you imagine the cars that would be on the roads without these and other related protections.

If you don't understand the ethical implications of title washing I can't explain them to you.





Apparently you do understand the ethical implications, but they don't concern you because it is legal. To me ethical and legal are not interchangeble words.


Section 321.52 of Iowa code

b. When a wrecked or salvage vehicle has been repaired, the owner may apply for a regular certificate of title by paying the appropriate fees and surrendering the salvage certificate of title and a properly executed salvage theft examination certificate. The county treasurer shall issue a regular certificate of title which shall bear a designation stamped or printed on the face of the title and stamped and printed on the registration receipt indicating that the vehicle was previously titled on a salvage certificate of title in a form approved by the department. This designation shall be included on every Iowa certificate of title and registration receipt issued thereafter for the vehicle. The stamped designation shall be in black and shall be in letters no bigger than sixteen point type and located on the center of the right side of the registration receipt. However, if ownership of a stolen vehicle has been transferred to an insurer organized under the laws of this state or admitted to do business in this state, or if the transfer was the result of a settlement with the owner of the vehicle arising from damage to or the unrecovered theft of the vehicle, and if the insurer certifies to the county treasurer on a form approved by the department that the insurance company has received one or more written estimates which state that the retail cost of repairs including labor, parts, and other materials of all damage to the vehicle is less than three thousand dollars, the county treasurer shall issue to the insurance company the regular certificate of title and registration receipt without this designation.

The title is still branded if the rules are followed. You just found a loophole and walked on through it.

John McGraw

The fact that a C2 corvette has a salvage title should have absolutely no effect on the value of the car. Would it make a difference in the value of a 2003 model, you bet it would!
The value of these old cars is driven primarily by the correctness and the condition. A midyear with a salvage title and a national Top Flight would bring just as much as a similar car with a non-salvage title. The car could have just been totaled for something as little as the need for a front clip 15 years ago.
The Salvage car could quite concievably have the original engine and drivetrain. There are hundreds of complete hulks that are revived to Top Flight status, and the quality of the rerstoration is the driving force when it comes to price. A state-issued VIN will hurt the value (but will not hurt the judging score) of a car, but a salvage title should not.
Also, as everyone is aware, there are so many ways to get the SALVAGE stamp off the title, that it is not even funny. That being said, I could not see going to the trouble to do so, given that it really has no effect.
Some people would feel compelled to do so just because they are **** retentive and want it off the title, but it will not equate in to more dollars at the time of sale, so I see no ethical of fraud issues. It is only fraud and unethical if the intent is to fool somebody into giving you more money that they would have without the change, and, In my opinion, there is not 1 more dollar in value to be gained by removal of this stamp from the title. The salvage title simply says that the car was totaled out by an insurance company, and there was a time when only a thousand or two dollars would do this to a midyear. Many of us have replaced almost every body panel on a car, and still gotten top dollar for the car when sold, so clearly the ammount of damage a car has seen in it's past is no indication of it's current value.

Regards, John McGraw

Plastic Pig

with most of that.

But the key word in that first paragraph is should. I agree it should make no difference on a car that has every part replaced or repaired anyway, however it does. Take two identical cars, one with a salvage/branded title, one without and see which brings more money.

Not every car gets a body-off soup to nuts resto.

Say seller X buys a car with a salvage/branded title due to accident damage. He slaps on a nose, has his buddy rgs wash the title through Iowa and its sold to buyer Z with no mention of previous accident damage.

Mr.and Mrs. Z not knowing about the previous accident go merrily along their way and take his car out for a sunny Sunday drive only to have the right front suspension collapse as a result of previous damage from an undisclosed accident and his wife is killed.

Now suppose the title was still branded repaired. Maybe he would have taken a closer look at the car or had a mechanic inspect it before he puchased/drove it. Maybe not. Its sure too late to ask now.

A branded title should stay branded forever to protect the consumer.

rgs

Uh, correction, you left off the title to the section you referenced.

321.52 OUT-OF-STATE SALES -- JUNKED, DISMANTLED, WRECKED, OR SALVAGE VEHICLES.

My explination was in state purchase by a resident and I have first hand knowledge. I bought an 86 Escort GT from a salvage yard in Iowa Falls, IA. It had a salvage title. I rebuilt it. I called the DOT for an inspection. A highway patrol officer came to my shop and inspected the car. He verified the numbers on the engine, vin, and transmission. He wanted to see receipts for the hood, grill, and fender. He had no interest in anything else about the car. He would not comment on the quality of the repair, said he couldn't. He was the one who related to me the description and intent of salvage titles. He then gave me a document to take along with the salvage title to the county courthouse. There, I was issued a current title with no other identification or branding.

As to the ethics, on a car of this vintage who cares if it has been totaled before? Anyone buying a 40 year old car needs to have it inspected. It may never have been wrecked, but may have dangerous rust or other problems. It means nothing to this situation. If it was properly repaired, which the inspection would verify, what is the problem?

John McGraw

Bob,
I have bought a lot of cars over the years, and I would not let the salvage title influence my opinon of the price at all, and I do not think that most classic car guys would either. I would buy based on options, correctness and condition, and these are the only things that factor into the decision.

While I agree that the salvage title has a very valid purpose, I would submit that it's value is non-exsistent on a 45 year old car.
How many Corvettes break in half because of terminal rust in the kick-ups? An untouched original car from the rust belt probably poses more of a threat to your safety than a car which has been rebuilt with a salvage title. Anybody who buys a classic car of this age without determining the condition of the car is a fool, and the absence of a Salvage stamp on a title buys him absolutely nothing as when it comes to piece-of-mind that the car is a safe car.
Also, keep in mind, that the fact that a car was severly damaged, will quite often not result in the car having a slavage title. Regardless of the ammount of damage, in most states, if the car is returned to the owner, it does not recieve the salvage title. It only recieves the salvage title if it is sold by the insurance comapny to a salvage dealer, or rebuilder.

Regards, John McGraw

Plastic Pig

That was just the section I copied it out of. The theme continues ad-infinitum through every section of Iowa code pertaining to salvage vehicles.


The inspection the Trooper performed was to make sure you weren't using stolen parts on your rebuilt car Nothing more and nothing less. That was the reason for his inspection, not the reason for the law.

Look it up. The exact scenario with whys and wherefors is described in Iowa code.





John,

You would submit, and I would agree to the point of salvage title value on a 45 year old car. Once again though our opinion is not reality and the salvage status does have a marked difference in value.

Also John, and no offense to anyone, but look at the level of automotive knowledge of the typical noob buyer that posts here.
At least a branded title might send up a warning flare for them to be cautious. With all the other fraud and deception facing them out there will this safegaurd hurt anyone ?

I would want to know if Bubba rebuilt the car with bailing wire or if it was done correctly. Washing the title also eliminates all traces of what was done and by whom.

Comparing it to a car with a regular title breaking in half is not relevant to this topic, as there were no safegaurds in place to prevent this from happening to begin with.

I will also reiterate my opinion that not all 40 year old cars have body-off restoration performed.

rgs

Actually it doesn't. Read the code further. There are variations depending on the circumstances.
I agree the inspection was to ensure stolen parts were not used. Hence the reason I was granted a clean title afterwards. That is the law. Not my interpretation, but what actually occurred. It had nothing to do with "branding" the vehicle for eternity. At least here in Iowa, a salvage title could legally be cleared through this process. I did it.