merlot566jka

As I thought, 210's are a bit over zealous, it would encourage me to over revv. I like the idea of the AFR 195s... it eliminates the questions on my head for repair, and I suspect it will have a crisp and sharper throttle response as opposed to the larger port AI 195's and the AFR 210's. I am not seeking peak power, so leaving a few hp at 7000rpm is fine, no need to overdo it. Even though its tempting.

merlot566jka

those 36# injectors are rated 36# at 60psi. 32psi around 45psi. Those may work perfect.

merlot566jka

Looking at the racetronix hotwire setup now. Have had it saved in my favorites forever.

littlesk8cracker

haha i stand corrected!

merlot566jka

it happens

merlot566jka

Looking at the Mike Jones website :http://www.jonescams.com/ehr_series.htm
I am finding that the cams look to be single profile, So would I need to have them make me one with both the EHR71360 for intake and EHR72360 for exhaust?
Or was this an either or choice?

BTW, this looks alot like the cc503 with just a bit more lift. Without knowing the whole shape of the lobe, I wonder why I havent seen this cam pop up on any discussions. Regardless, I think it looks great for my goal.

rklessdriver

Those aren't cams per say listed on his site. That is a lobe MASTER list. Everything he does is custom ground. There are no shelf stocking cams.

So the "EHR" is the lobe series. 71360 is the intake lobe and the 72360 is the exhaust lobe. You want it put on 108 intake centerline and 112 lobe seperation, which is 4* advance.

All I can tell you about why you don't see it pop in discussions is because most people don't know enough about cams to know the difference in the numbers. They have read enough to be really dangerous.... they know they want a 230@50 and that 112LSA makes it easy to tune the EFI for..... They know Comp Cams from the magazine advertisements and contingency stickers on race cars.

Comps advertising coupled with decent running stuff makes it a hard sell to the average Joe who dosen't know who Mike Jones is or what advantages there are to running his lobe profiles.

It's funny you compare the EHR lobes to the Comp XE lobes (which the Comp 503 is built on)... They both use concept that I remember being very popular on mech roller lobes back in the 1980's. They utilize an inverse flank which gives you a very fast opening @ the valve and makes a small advertised duration lobe act like a much bigger one in reguard to RPM capabilty. Think of the opening ramps shaped similar to the side of a peanut and you'll get the idea.

This is greatly simplified but if you look at, the same 276* of advertised duration - Mikes EHR71360 lobe is 8* bigger @.050 and 6* bigger @.200 than the CC503's intake lobe (XE3314), not to mention a bigger lobe which is more valve lift.

That = more potential HP with no increase in overlap/difficulty in the part throttle driveability. That is part of the reason why I run his cams.

There are a couple of other people that post in C4 Tech that have Mikes Cams in their cars. For example this guy post here but I don't remember if his internet handle on CF is the same or not.

http://ls1tech.com/forums/11-second-...-invasion.html

Will

merlot566jka

Shipping heads to AI today.

About to buy pistons, rings, cam and gaskets

Still looking for a machine shop with less than a 3 week turnaround.

Are the felpro gasket sets any good? Other than the thinner headgasket, is there any need to get gaskets else where?

merlot566jka

rod bolts?
head bolts?
are the felpros ok, or should I go with ARP?

STL94LT1

^^^ Definately go with ARP!!

merlot566jka

ok, done

96GS#007

You will need to have the rods checked and likely re-sized as well.

By the time you buy rod bolts, have the rods checked, and have them re-sized it can be nearly as cheap as buying new.

For head gaskets, I like the GM 1996 Impala SS head gaskets or Victor Reinz (p/n 5898, .026 compressed). Either will bump compression slightly....about half a point. I ran ~12:1 static CR on pump gas for years with my LT4 Hot Cam and GM 846 cam engines, so no worries on the street.

ARP for head bolts.

Stay away from low tension rings...little more power at the expense of significant oil usage. Some will go through a quart every 500 miles.

merlot566jka

pistonsProbe, SRS ForgedPBP-12334-030 $ 442.79 419.98**********ringsMahle, Precision GroundPCR-3150036-030 $ 109.95 111.7**********gasketsSealed PowerSLP-260-1650 $ 185.99 169.98**********throttle bodySummit Racing 58mmSUM-227703 $ 244.95 213.63**********flywheelspec sc05a $ 431.95 359.1**********rod boltsARP HPARP-134-6005 $ 69.16 head boltsARP HPARP-134-3601 $ 77.15 Adjustable FPRAeromotiveAEI-13106 $ 163.95 162.88**********ClutchSpec Stage 2+SC423YH $ 591.00 449.1**********CamMike Jones ERHehr71360/ehr72360 $ 325.00 346.29**********Head workAI215cc Competition LT4 $ 1,450.00 boyds autoclean block bore .030 with plate $ 150.00 balance rotating assymbly $ 180.00 intall pistons to rods $ 45.00 install cam bearings $ 20.00 intall rod bolts, resize$72.00 $ 4,558.89 $ 2,232.66

That is the list of what I bought. Shopped for the best prices. I didnt see low tension on the rings...

cv67

So how is a rebuilt 206cc head that moves less air any better?
Youre right in the $ range of a new set of AFRs too.

Food for thought.

Fwiw lots of the lsx engines use low tension rings and last a long time.
Do whats best for you though.

merlot566jka

Air velocity. Thats what I am assuming.

In my mind, I compared the valve sizes to the port sizes... clearly the AI has a higher port velocity keeping with the stock valves.

And the sense that it made to me was good idle with a high lift/duration cam.

With out two assembled engines to compare the heads, I cant really say which is better... high flow, or high velocity.

We could use the helmholtz theory and try to calculate which is better, judging off the cams profile, intake length, and valve size... but then we would just know which rpm the package is most effective. We would have to go into a lot more to determine, number wise, which is the best.
What I am saying is, who knows which one is actually better... each will have its benefit. Its hard to compare, since obviously they arent the same. Is airspeed as important as volume/time, or are they the same thing?

And looking at the big picture... I do not have a race car, saving a couple hundred bucks on the AI heads vs the AFR is a good idea to me. The extra 10-25hp that may get left on the table isnt going to make me lose any sleep. If anything, I will have more money to fuel my new engine!

About the low tension thing, I didnt see it advertised as low tension rings... And I havent read much about low tension rings. I assume these are not.

rklessdriver

A few thoughts-

The ring set PN you bought has STD tension oil rings. It also has a napier second compression rings which cuts down on alot of friction. You bought the .030 set which is not usually file fit ina 4.030 bore - but you still need to check the gaps and may need to file fit them to get the gaps perfect.

You can't really compare the LSX ring pack to the SBC. The LSX has a 6.125" long connecting rod and the LSX deck height is nearly 1/4" taller than the LTX SBC which gives the LSX piston alot more stability in the bore. The LSX ring pack has 3mm oil rings and most of those sets are only a smidge lighter than a common 3/16 std tension racing oil ring.

I don't think you should spend the $$$ to put ARP bolts in the stock PM rods.... If the machine shop has not started on them yet, send the bolts back and leave the PM rods alone... Your going to be $140+ into a set of stock PM rods and you can buy new SCAT or Eagle SIR rods for $225 and have 10X the strength....

I can't find any specs on the Head Gaskets used in that SP kit. I'm sure they are thicker but I have no idea how it will compare to the SCR and DCR numbers that I calculated for you.

On the heads. I like AFR and no doubt in my mind they would be better but the AI LT4 heads are an exellant head for the $$$ and for what your doing.

Will

merlot566jka

What do you recommend for the gap?

I havent gotten the parts to the shop yet, and the parts havent come in yet... So I will stick with stock on those rods.

rklessdriver

Top - .018-.020
2nd - .020-.022

Will

merlot566jka

removed and tore down today
http://s26.photobucket.com/albums/c1...20destruction/

rklessdriver

Damage is about what I expected. Some of it will surface out and some will machine out when they CNC the chamber... Hopefully they won't have to weld too much up.

Will