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Nope, I don't believe from what I found and my experience with 6 Vettes, street rod etc that K&N, aFe or HALLTECH are BS. Yep if a cheap pleated paper paper filter is folks choice sobeit!
Bugatti Veyron - paper filters
Ferrari Enzo - paper filter
Lamborghini Aventador - paper filters
Pagani Zonda - paper filter, 4 million dollar car
I dont think your view of paper = manufacturers cheapening out carries any weight
Already? The Owner’s Manual says to change at 45,000 miles!
Anyway, the stock AC Delco 84321605 is cheap, lasts 45K miles and you won’t get any BS from the dealer about voided warranty if you have any engine issues.
I have a C8 and I need to get a new filter. Any preferences and why?
Might as well get a low restriction filter. This is what I installed and a How To PDF. It's a bit of a PIA but just a time issue NOT degree of difficulty: http://netwelding.com/C8_Air_Intake.pdf
Note is a many picture/long caption doc and probably more info then you want! But if it's a DIY of even a stock filter PDF may be of help.
Note aFe made some minor changes so pic left is slighlty different than present offering.
Look at the number of pleats between the two. More pleats, more dirt holding capacity. Stick with the stock filter if you are want the best filtration.
^^^
Yep, BUT the principle of oiled cotton collecting dirt (covered in detail in my PDF) is different than looking at cheap paper pleated surface area! There is good data to show oiled cotton filters have perhaps 5% less dirt collecting capacity (by design to maximize flow) but can be changed more often and cleaned at essentially no cost. IF you're keeping you C8 for 100,000 miles might be an issue!
Understand many won't read my detailed info about oiled cotton filter info in my PDF. Below is an excellent video by Jason Fenske who provides very interesting detailed tests with 4 filters including an oiled cotton K&N. Note K&N did not sponsor his work! In addition to dyno tests he does real world driving tests and in 45 to 60 mph acceleration tests he shows the K&N oiled cotton achieved about 3% more power AND the same ~3% faster 45-to 60 acceleration. Don't know what the aFe filter provides (was not my reason for using) but 3% of 495 hp is 15 hp! Doubt it's that high but the Attack aftermarket filter shows 11hp dyno gain. I've called an aFe engineer and frankly they will only dyno test their ~$1000 low restriction system that uses two conical cone filters in a specially designed filter housing! Frankly 5 hp is enough for me to have 500 hp! Frankly increased sucking sound as I have in my street rod was my objective in addition to being able to clean at ~15,000 miles and not wait until 45,000 where there are hp losses from the dirt in a cheap paper filter! Your Car Your Choice!
I posted a link to the Jason Fenske video (who does an excellent job in other video's showing why the C8 accelerates so fast and many other engineering topics) in my PDF with this comment. "Jason is a Mechanical Engineer and has many car related videos on his Engineering Explained website. He tested the K&N, AN OEM dirty filter, OEM new filter and another paper filter. He includes not only dyno tests but also actual 20 to 60 mph and 45 to 60 mph runs with interesting significant differences." Since I have ME degrees and formal training and practical use of statistically sound testing methods, appreciated his comment about performing his tests in a random sequence to avoid time and inevitable background change bias!He also repeated each test to provide a “feel” for repeatability measurement error. Also see the coffee cup daughter sent me for Christmas below!
Note I also presented the full Forum Post by Tadge Juechter re aftermarket filters and this short summary: “Aside from the exhaust, there is no greater noise source on a performance vehicle than the intake system. Induction systems generally have many tuning elements that ensure the quality of the sound emanating from it are pleasing and harmonious with the exhaust note. These tuning elements also dampen the sound energy to help with pass-by legal noise requirements. Aftermarket companies don't have to worry about it, but as the OEM, we must guarantee that our products are quiet enough to be driven at full throttle by a microphone by the side of the road and meet certain decibel levels. There are pass-by laws in many states and pretty universal around the world. As with many of the questions on this forum, all vehicle design is a balance of trade-offs. We do what is legal and right for the vast majority of customers. Aftermarket companies offer products that strike a different balance that might appeal to some folks.”
At 45,000 miles between changes, is cost even a meaningful consideration. If you want more "sucking sound" and less filtration go with the oiled filter, otherwise stick with the stock filter.
oiled filters are nice until its time to clean and you over oil the element.
Yep agree. I also show in my PDF the method I have used for years. Never had an issue with MAF contamination etc.
Use the filter manufacturer's cleaning solution.
Then wash is off carefully with very low pressure water. I let it dry, usually overnight
Then apply the proper oil ONLY on the top of each pleat. I wait an hour or so until in wicks down into the pleat.
There will be some areas on the bottom where the oil did not wet the cotton. Easilly seen as the oil is colored.
Put a drop on those areas and in another hour the cotton is fully pernitrate and the filter does not even feel oily (as it doesn't when you get it preoiled.)
Yep start in the evening and oil the next day! Like anything else on the car IF you know what you're doing it's a non issue. Then best to use the paper filter and change when it's clogged at 45,000 miles. Wonder what a dealer would charge as removing the trunk is a PIA!
BTW, aFe offers a non oiled low restriction filter for those who don't think they can reoil properly. It's just not as low a restriction:
If you are afraid of oil and don't think you can reoil properly aFe offers a non oiled replacement filer. It's lower restriction just not as low as oiled cotton.
If GM could get 5 hp and 1mpg from a different air filter, don't you think they would? Stick with OEM.
Nope read Tadge Juechter (Executive Chief Corvette Engineer) forum post re aftermarket filters! I'll repost the short version again you can read it in full in my PDF!
“Aside from the exhaust, there is no greater noise source on a performance vehicle than the intake system. Induction systems generally have many tuning elements that ensure the quality of the sound emanating from it are pleasing and harmonious with the exhaust note. These tuning elements also dampen the sound energy to help with pass-by legal noise requirements. Aftermarket companies don't have to worry about it, but as the OEM, we must guarantee that our products are quiet enough to be driven at full throttle by a microphone by the side of the road and meet certain decibel levels. There are pass-by laws in many states and pretty universal around the world. As with many of the questions on this forum, all vehicle design is a balance of trade-offs. We do what is legal and right for the vast majority of customers. Aftermarket companies offer products that strike a different balance that might appeal to some folks.”
BUT that's only from the Corvette Chief Engineer, what does he know? BTW he's also mechanical engineer!
Turning your air cleaner lid upside down on your 73 Monte Carlo makes a lot of noise too, but it doesn't make any more power. Oiled filter makers don't give a **** how much dirt they let into your engine either as they don't care if your motor wears out prematurely. The OEM filter obviously allows plenty of clean air in, the rest is just snake oil BS.
^^^
My ASME Section toured the large WIX filter plant in our area making oil and air filters. The engineer that toured us when asked why paper is used, said it's Cheap!
Here is a pic from my PDF when Oil filters were common- not cotton but oil! Yep folks will believe what they wish but I have ~10 page Appendix with pics from a K&N report on what they do with their engineers at their facility!
Nope NOT snake oil! I posted a composite of the pics I have in my intro. The detail with more pics are in a 10 page technical article in my PDF about K&N.
This is what I had on my 1950 Ford V8! Composite of some of the pics in a 10 page detailed article about K&N I put in my PDF. Their engineers spend a lot of time optimizing flow and dirt handling ability!
The engineer that toured us when asked why paper is used, said it's Cheap!
That's painting with a pretty broad brush just saying "they're cheap" You don't honestly believe that all paper elements are the same exact material do you? That's like saying I won't use aluminum wheels because when I was a kid my baseball left a dent in the aluminum siding on our house. Use what you want, but nobody could feel any difference between a stock OEM filter and some oiled filter with about 20 times less filtering surface area.
^^^
I have fun with this argument re filters! Has been going on for years! That is why I did the research and present facts. Some will read them, some will watch the Jason video, many will not and believe what they wish.
I particularly like the K&N info I include about the SAE test for filters. There is an SAE specification BUT you pick the dirt size to use from several listed! That is not standard! That's why when you see data showing an AC air filter is better than say Fram and another showing Fram is better than AC- both can be true! All covered in my PDF! Fun read for those who can take the time!
BTW WIX made a special air filter for NASCAR (as they did oil filter.) It no doubt has different paper and designed for the life of a NASCAR engine! I'm remined when Dale Inman, Petty's team manager when we were sponsors, telling me they used some 000 weight or some such designated oil for a HP gain. I asked if that was good for the engine? He said "Good enough for the 500 miles we need!
Already? The Owner’s Manual says to change at 45,000 miles!
Anyway, the stock AC Delco 84321605 is cheap, lasts 45K miles and you won’t get any BS from the dealer about voided warranty if you have any engine issues.
I can't believe it. Isn't it recommended to change air filters every 10k?
Has anyone with oil based filters on their C8 had their oil sent for analysis, looking for silica contamination, etc?
I don't live in an area where there is a lot of sand in the air, but it is florida and there is a lot of sand on the ground. Engine compartment routinely has sand everywhere sucked up from the ground.
Has anyone with oil based filters on their C8 had their oil sent for analysis, looking for silica contamination, etc?
I don't live in an area where there is a lot of sand in the air, but it is florida and there is a lot of sand on the ground. Engine compartment routinely has sand everywhere sucked up from the ground.
If you live in an area with a lot of silica like the beach or desert I would stay far away from these filters. They let more air through and they let a lot of silica through as well. There are a few legit, no bs, reviews of them and the consensus is running fine silica through your motor for an extra 5-10hp. No thanks.
Project Farm testing Purolator 1 and Wix came out on top. Oiled filter let through the most dirt (as expected)
BTW these results were on new filters that were perfectly oiled. Results will get somewhat worse over time as the filter is contaminated and oil becomes less effective.
I had a similar experience with an oiled filter a while back. Pulled it off and the intake had a ridiculous amount of grit in it. WAY more then any normal car should. Last time I used a oiled filter. For the track fine. Street, no way.
08-23-2021, 08:59 AM
Frankly increased sucking sound as I have in my street rod was my objective in addition to being able to clean at ~15,000 miles and not wait until 45,000 where there are hp losses from the dirt in a cheap paper filter! Your Car Your Choice!
